Can some kind knowledgeable owner of a Grande Punto GP 58 vintage with 16" alloys tell me the correct torque settings for the wheel bolts, and if the same setting applies to the factory locking bolts.

I would be most grateful because I have been unable to get this information from Fiat. Fiat dealers tell me that Fiat do not allow them to give out this sort of information, instead they are instructed to refer enquirers to a website, www.technicalinformation.fiat.com, however, this turns out to be set up for the trade to buy information, if you don't have a VAT number you can't register.

Fiat themselves tell me to contact a dealer for this sort of information, and are not now bothering to answer my emails. They also kindly told me that this information is not in the owners manual- precisely, that's why I was asking them !

Help, someone.

Thank you.

hi

you'll probably find that (a)the dealers don't know the correct torque for the wheel bolts as they probably air gun them on  ( am now awaiting a confused question from zana).... (b) also some dealers as they see it look up tech info for no gain  (c) some a worried that if a wheel then comes off ,that they will be held responsible .....only info i vcan find on fiat wheelnuts is for the mark 2 /3 punto ...which is 86Nm  or 63lbf ft in old money ..it really depends on the size of the bolt ie M12 etc fraid at the min that's all the info i have

 

phil

Thanks for your reply Phil,

Perhaps the information is sooo Top Secret, that Fiat don't even tell their main dealers !

Maybe that's why they know so little about the cars they sell.

On item (c), as long as the info they give you is correct, they can't be held legally responsible for what you then do with that information.

;-)

have done a bit of research ...steel and alloy wheels are the same torque ie you should have M12 X 1.5 pitch bolts..must be an italian thing but the info i can find says  value   (daNm) 10.8(then it's a division sign ) 13.2  ....it looks like 10.8 divided by 13.2..makes no sense to me ...hopefully marketing can give us it in good old Nm  htough i think my earlier figure is right

 

phil

meant to say  ..ref (C)  yep as long as they give the correct info ,there shouldn't be an comeback ..maybe the dealer has no confidence in their technicians  to get it right...have been in the trade for way too long myself though on trucks ,which if you have one with 32 mm  nuts the torque is 700 Nm   lol..but the local merc truck dealer won't give out any tech info at all.where if a customer asks us for info on the make i do we always give it ..but it can be a pain looking it up as it generally involves stopping work on a paying customers vehicle who is waiting and may be in a rush ,to help someone who does his own maintainance

 

phil

Thanks for your efforts, can't find any reference to daNm, strange isn't it that all these motor manufacturers seem to be a law unto themselves, I thought it was European Law, to open up the strangle hold dealers had on new car servicing, that any garage can now carry out services, without invalidating warranties, and the manufacturers had to issue technical information to anyone asking for it, to enable non-dealers to carry out work, but try asking for a torque setting and its closed shop again, perhaps I should report Fiat to the competition commission for not complying.  ;)

hi

well i wouldn't blame fiat for what the dealers do ...but as you say euro law  does mean any VAT registered garage  can service a car as long as they use the manufacturers parts to maintain the warranty ,which to be honest is not bad considering they aren't approved by the manufacturer...to accept responsibility for the failure of a part  when the vehicle isn't maintained by the manufacturers agents is  impressive ..though i don't know what happens when someone claims under those circumstances ,after all there may be certain items requiring attention that the independent  may not know about  or if they do  may ignore ,,,,where as with the fiat approved dealer there isn't an excuse /get out clause as all servicing IS done  by the book ...lol...the handbook does mention check tech data for wheel nut torque but doesn't then give it ...as you say  tech data isn't  a secret now ...but  why should a dealer  then spend half there day looking up info  for free??? i will say i am loking at it from both points ..though  i will admit wheel torque should  not be a problem after all surely they re-torque wheels daily ????and it isn't something they have to look up ???the first figure i gave is from haynes   the second was from a fiat source .....

Hi, Happy February,

Whilst I agree with much you say, I would answer, "but why should a dealer then spend half their day looking up info for free "  well (a) it is offering a service to their customers, and, (b) they are not doing it for free, they made a considerable amount of money from me when I bought the car from them.

Also, as with most main dealers, your main contact is not the person ' being dragged away from working on a car ' but a Service Reception know-it-not who spends all day sat in front of a computer monitor, and therefore has the information a couple of clicks away. The point is not that they can't get the info, or that they don't know it, its Fiat, who apparently, are forbidding their dealers from giving the info to their customers.

Once again though thanks for your input, its beginning to feel that you and I are the only people in this ghost town, or, the torques are so secret, any member out there that have them have been sworn to secrecy, because its that ,or, not one owner of a Grande Punto in this country knows the correct torque for their wheel bolts.

Worrying, isn't it !

alas ...receptionist know nothing ,they like to pretend they do ...after all most have trouble making up the job card never mind finding tech info ...well our receptionist are ,though they do specialise in diagnoising faults ,are completely wrong ..in the truck side we are generally on first names with most drivers /owners/companies.i don't think fiat are restricing the info ,as where do haynes get theirs ???

i agree that ,yep we all have spent a considerable amount of money on our cars ...but the service  department in car dealers are only interested in you when a service is due.....all i can suggest  is go to the salesman who you got the car from and ask him to get it ...from being in the trade unfortunately jobs are timed ..eg say fiat states on a service it should only take an hour so thats all fiat will pay the dealer,so if the mechanic takes 2 hours ,thats an hour lost ,that the dealer has to absorb...but as i said before wheel torque  they should know ,not as if your asking head bolt torque...can't understand why marketing haven't responded to this thread ....just thought maybe it's a mafia thing ..no one shall know the wheel torque  lol

Oh dear! Horses head on its way.

;)

have spoke to a mate i know in fiat today  he said he'd find the torque ..then i forgot lol

phil

Fiatsco, phil

Block exemption regulation means we have an obligation to supply independent repairer the same technical information available to our dealers.

This was designed to promote competition and prevent an unfair advantage to manufacturer's own dealer franchises by withholding information.

We charge our dealers for access to this information and therefore must also charge anyone else the same price to ensure a level playing field.

The www.technicalinformation.fiat.com website enables you to buy access from as little as an hour to a year.

The system does ask for company details and a VAT number, however if a VAT number is not applicable, as in the case of individuals, anything entered into this field should allow you to register.

daNm means Deca Newton metres (Newton metres divided by 10), so to convert daNm to Nm, just multiply the figure by ten (1daNm=10Nm).

The divide symbol used is an Italian way of indicating “between”, in the UK we would use a dash. So the two figures are the lower & upper tolerances.

Kind regards
Fiat Marketing

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Fiat Marketing, thank you for the info, however, the fact that as a company you would charge a customer for the information necessary to check that the wheel bolts are tightened properly on their car, is, at least, disgraceful.

I for one can promise you that I will never, and I mean never, buy another Fiat for as long as I live, and I sure won't be recommending them to anyone else.

Customer Service ? You have no idea.

 Phil, thanks for your help but as far as I'm concerned this subject is now closed, all the best.

Why are you  so hell bent on knowing this info? Scenario..You have a puncture,you change your wheel, you hand tighten the bolts!

Torque setting...what torque setting?? Just make sure the bolts are bloody tight its not rocket science my friend!

 

hi marketing thanks for explaining how the italians system works...and how to convert their settings,and what the symbols mean....

i know all about the block exemption ..i was just trying to help fiatco ...and was trying to put it over ,as a customer and also as a technician in a truck dealership ...as you will be aware technicians have to account for every minute of their day ,as the company has to bill someone for their time ..as techs are the only ones that aren't a cost to a company...so to look up info technically costs the company and may delay a vehicle being worked on ,which then upsets  a  customer...also techs are the only ones who will know how to look up the info .....then again surely certain figures are in the head...as i said earlier in a thread ..we look up tech info for customers ,sometimes faxing /e-mailing the relevant page from the computer ..which we don't charge for (pause evo AD ON )LOL   anyway that is our company's way of doing it ..as we also lend out special tools ..though customer do supply an order number in the event it isn't returned or damaged...

like tilly i use the wheel brace...it is the length it is ..so you don't overtighten the bolts,no need to stand on it  or extend it ...over tightening is as bad as loose bolts...once initally tightened go for a 15 min run and recheck...and that includes wheels you have torqued ....though if someone wants to do anything  by the book ...i will do my best to help and never criticise ,as that is how i teach apprentices ..helps them get a feel for how tight bolts should be ..as for never buying another fiat like us all freedom to choose what we buy ...no 1 person or company is perfect ,it's how the company /person deal with the issues  that matters

well marketing if you started reading this when you got in this morn  ,it;s gone time to go home   lol

 

phil